Sticky/Jerky Steering issue

[Leehro]

Edit 2023-10-14: This problem is still happening intermittently, regardless of CarPlay/USB connection. It matches the problem reported for 2022+ Honda Civic investigated in https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/inv/2023/INOA-PE23005-3644.PDF. It May occur more at colder temps. My original experience with seemed to be related to CarPlay and USB (see below), but it's been happening without those things

Edit 2023-10-25: My dealership replaced the EPS steering rack in my integra today. Hopefully that fixes it.

Edit 2023-10-31: so far so good. Replacing the steering rack is expensive (for Acura) but seems like it’s the fix available today. Hope this one is good for more than 3000 miles
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I got in the Integra this afternoon to drive about 25 miles (and back). I noticed a few strange behaviors with CarPlay and a problem with the steering. The first clue that something wasn't right was that wireless CarPlay activated when I started the car. I don't use wireless CarPlay, in fact I keep Bluetooth turned off in the Integra so that it can't connect automatically. I hadn't turned it on, but today it came on. I scolded the car, connected with the USB cable I always use, and turned off Bluetooth again. Everything seemed OK.

I looked up the destination in Apple Maps and started to drive. Before I got out of my neighborhood, I noticed the navigation display was lagging. Seemed more like a phone/GPS issue - the CarPlay UI was responsive, but the marker was consistently stuck a few intersections back or slightly off the road and saying "Proceed to the Route". I chalked it up to a phone issue and decided to reboot that later.

As I got out onto the 45MPH somewhat curvy roads, I noticed the steering was behaving strangely. At low speeds (from stop lights), the wheel turned fine. But cruising at 45-50, the wheel was very resistant to any slight movements to correct and stay straight or go around a turn. I've got 3000 miles on the car so I know what the steering feels like in Comfort, Sport, and Normal I tried all 3 and they didn' t make a difference. It felt very "sticky", like the wheel wanted to stay in place. I could turn it slightly, take my hand off, and it would stay. And If I wanted to turn it, I had to apply more force than usual. Felt like power steering was broken, but again only at cruising speeds. I made sure LKAS and departure warnings were off - but again I know what those feel like and this wasn't it. The whole trip, maps was always behind. I was out in the clear, no reason for GPS to have trouble. Music playback and control was fine though.

I got to where I was going, turned the car off (but left the phone plugged in to USB). When I started up again 10 minutes later, same problem. It felt normal driving in the parking lot, but once I got above like 35MPH, steering became very jerky again. Maps was still acting up.

When I was about 5 miles from home (still on a 45MPH road, but straighter), I pulled the USB cable out of the console and disconnected CarPlay. Instantly, the steering feel came back to normal. After a minute or two I tried plugging the USB cable back in, but CarPlay wouldn't reconnect. Seems like the phone or the infotainment were having trouble communicating.

I wouldn't think there would be any way the iPhone USB connection could be causing a problem with steering, but it seems pretty clear that's what was happening. Am I nuts? Anyone seen anything like this?

My guess (as a programmer who's never worked on critical real-time systems like those in a car) is that the iPhone was sending bad data or too many updates and overwhelming the infotainment system. Or the infotainment booted up in a buggy state and couldn't ever process things right. Either way, I'm not sure how it could interfere with the computers controlling the steering feedback, but I suppose if that's tied into the instrument cluster display and such, it's possible. wtf.

 

[submitaweasel]

I got in the Integra this afternoon to drive about 25 miles (and back). I noticed a few strange behaviors with CarPlay and a problem with the steering. The first clue that something wasn't right was that wireless CarPlay activated when I started the car. I don't use wireless CarPlay, in fact I keep Bluetooth turned off in the Integra so that it can't connect automatically. I hadn't turned it on, but today it came on. I scolded the car, connected with the USB cable I always use, and turned off Bluetooth again. Everything seemed OK.

I looked up the destination in Apple Maps and started to drive. Before I got out of my neighborhood, I noticed the navigation display was lagging. Seemed more like a phone/GPS issue - the CarPlay UI was responsive, but the marker was consistently stuck a few intersections back or slightly off the road and saying "Proceed to the Route". I chalked it up to a phone issue and decided to reboot that later.

As I got out onto the 45MPH somewhat curvy roads, I noticed the steering was behaving strangely. At low speeds (from stop lights), the wheel turned fine. But cruising at 45-50, the wheel was very resistant to any slight movements to correct and stay straight or go around a turn. I've got 3000 miles on the car so I know what the steering feels like in Comfort, Sport, and Normal I tried all 3 and they didn' t make a difference. It felt very "sticky", like the wheel wanted to stay in place. I could turn it slightly, take my hand off, and it would stay. And If I wanted to turn it, I had to apply more force than usual. Felt like power steering was broken, but again only at cruising speeds. I made sure LKAS and departure warnings were off - but again I know what those feel like and this wasn't it. The whole trip, maps was always behind. I was out in the clear, no reason for GPS to have trouble. Music playback and control was fine though.

I got to where I was going, turned the car off (but left the phone plugged in to USB). When I started up again 10 minutes later, same problem. It felt normal driving in the parking lot, but once I got above like 35MPH, steering became very jerky again. Maps was still acting up.

When I was about 5 miles from home (still on a 45MPH road, but straighter), I pulled the USB cable out of the console and disconnected CarPlay. Instantly, the steering feel came back to normal. After a minute or two I tried plugging the USB cable back in, but CarPlay wouldn't reconnect. Seems like the phone or the infotainment were having trouble communicating.

I wouldn't think there would be any way the iPhone USB connection could be causing a problem with steering, but it seems pretty clear that's what was happening. Am I nuts? Anyone seen anything like this?

My guess (as a programmer who's never worked on critical real-time systems like those in a car) is that the iPhone was sending bad data or too many updates and overwhelming the infotainment system. Or the infotainment booted up in a buggy state and couldn't ever process things right. Either way, I'm not sure how it could interfere with the computers controlling the steering feedback, but I suppose if that's tied into the instrument cluster display and such, it's possible. wtf.

I can tell you, without a doubt, the infotainment is integrated to the display. I can list reasons if you want. The main one I can cite is when mine acts up, the HUD changes.

I'm so happy that those with experience in these areas are seeing problems with this car as I had my suspicions with my experience but I am not a programmer, I just dabble when needed.

Sorry, not happy you are experiencing problems, but happy that my suspicions were corroborated. I don't wish these issues on anyone.

 

[submitaweasel]

Followup: the steering feedback is already integrated in the infotainment. Drive modes, baby.

Let us mechanical and programical buddies link up and defeat the machine

 

[Leehro]

Followup: the steering feedback is already integrated in the infotainment. Drive modes, baby

oh I know .

 

[submitaweasel]

oh I know .

For real though you made a few valid points that I had been questioning. I'd be interested to know your take as your experience moves forward.

 

[KiloFTW]

I have some experience with software dev and while I want to say that it’s crazy that a phone could interfere with steering, the steering is obviously computer assisted.

Regardless of cause it sounds like a safety issue and I’d report it immediately to your dealer and Acura.

 

[Leehro]

Yeah I’ll take it in. I do want to be clear that the car didn’t feel unsafe, just that the steering was a “sticky” when trying to make minor corrections. And the CarPlay acting up seemed relevant.

 

[OEMjoe]

Yess a nerd thread!

I've worked with lots of startups with proprietary "systems" and they are almost always buggy to hell. You'd be so surprised what kinda crap companies roll out to the public because of pressure from stakeholders.

Hard to pinpoint from a forum but sounds like you're getting some interference or noise on a hardware level. Might be an electrical diagnosis pain in the ass for your tech

But Infotainment and drive systems should exist on different logics and only send signals to communicate with each other for safety reasons. But, who knows, I've seen some weird shit.

Try a hard electrical reset of the car?

 

[TheRas900]

Uh oh, this is a big problem. Search the 11th gen Civic forums for how prevalent "sticky steering" is on those cars. I was hoping it wouldn't be an issue on the Integra, but this seems to be the first report. Almost all Civic owners who have experienced this had it start a few thousand miles into ownership, and not from the jump. There are about 3 dozen complaints on the NHTSA website.

 

[Leehro]

Uh oh, this is a big problem. Search the 11th gen Civic forums for how prevalent "sticky steering" is on those cars. I was hoping it wouldn't be an issue on the Integra, but this seems to be the first report. Almost all Civic owners who have experienced this had it start a few thousand miles into ownership, and not from the jump. There are about 3 dozen complaints on the NHTSA website.

Wow thanks for the info. I didn’t think to check if it was a civic problem too but obviously that makes a ton of sense. And I have 3700 miles on the car so that tracks too.

 

[Leehro]

Yeah you weren't kidding: https://www.civic11forum.com/search/75785/?q=sticky+steering&o=relevance

Definitely what I was feeling. I'll see what happens today and if having my phone plugged in makes a difference.

 

[KiloFTW]

Good luck, keep us posted on the service experience

 

[Leehro]

Went out for about an hour today, no problems with steering. Different initial conditions though - CarPlay worked as expected and maps didn’t lag. I was on different roads but still was able to check 45-50mph.

still going to make an appointment to take it in after the holiday though.

 

[RRP RSX-S]

Yeah you weren't kidding: https://www.civic11forum.com/search/75785/?q=sticky+steering&o=relevance

Definitely what I was feeling. I'll see what happens today and if having my phone plugged in makes a difference.

Read through all the threads. Seems like the evidence points to EPS gear box and/or steering rack. Small defects in the rack at higher speed and heat from long drives show up. Also there is a CRV recall for EPS gear box short circuiting causing power steering to go out. I think if they replaced the gearbox and rack, you should be good.

 

[TheRas900]

Yeah you weren't kidding: https://www.civic11forum.com/search/75785/?q=sticky+steering&o=relevance

Definitely what I was feeling. I'll see what happens today and if having my phone plugged in makes a difference.

Yeppers, lots of people have experienced this issue. It apparently comes and goes. I would keep your appointment.