Has anyone seen any Clues drop?

[TigerEyeJazz]

Im kinda curious to how the car will sell becuase as was said, if you look at the mainstream performance options like GTI,GLI,Elantra N, WRX. This will be significantly underpowered compared to those. However this will have better inputs and driving feel. This will also have a better interior than all. You can make an argument for the Elantra N.

Then you have the Mazda 3. That has AWD, +40hp and +128 torque. The interior is equal or better and is well equipped for the base model. The exterior looks better imo but lacks interior space that the Integra will have. The Integra will likely feel better to drive.

You got the Germans which include things like the A class, Cla and A3. In general they will have less interior space and cargo capacity but are more stylish exterior wise. They will be more expensive to start and to add options. Integra wins in value. Integra will have more power than the A class and be on par with an A3(fwd) in power. The A3 does have the advantage of the mild hybrid system which may appeal to some. The Cla and A3(AWD) provide more power and torque and will be better in a straight line. The Integra again will be better in handling and feel.

Then I want to talk about Hondas own lineup. If you're fine with a sedan and don't mind the feature taken, the Civic Si is a good option. Similar speed ,similar interior design. If you like creature comforts more the touring sedan or sport touring are both good options. However they will be down 20hp, missing the LSD and will have a CVT compared to the predicted dct in the Integra. For similar money to the Integra you can also step into an EXL Accord or a Sport 2.0T. With the accord you'll miss on the hatch but gain passenger space. You'll get more power and a 10 speed if you get the 2.0T. However you'll miss on handling features the Integra offers.

Again there is alot of choice out there. I'm curious to see what people will pick.

I think it’s fair to say the Integra would compete in one of the most over crowded segments for cars right now. Logically thinking is still think the Elantra N-Line competes with Base Integra and then Type S with N that makes more sense.

 

[RandomHondafan]

I think it’s fair to say the Integra would compete in one of the most over crowded segments for cars right now. Logically thinking is still think the Elantra N-Line competes with Base Integra and then Type S with N that makes more sense.

In terms of the performance yes. The Integra is more inline with the Elantra N Line. However a full loaded Elantra N is 34,445 including destination. I'm sure there will be 1.5t Integras that are as expensive. I feel like more customers would shop and EN vs an Integra than the N Line

 

[TigerEyeJazz]

In terms of the performance yes. The Integra is more inline with the Elantra N Line. However a full loaded Elantra N is 34,445 including destination. I'm sure there will be 1.5t Integras that are as expensive. I feel like more customers would shop and EN vs an Integra than the N Line

Elantra N-Line interior from what I was in at an autoshow looks nice but cheap material and seats. Also hate how they gave the N-Line halogens when it costs so little to have LED lights. Oh also the gauges looks terrible in the none digital display. I’ll be honest I almost went for an Elantra N but decided not to.

 

[Nerd-Vol]

Where do you think it falls if its Base AWD and 220+ HP? Assuming everything else is constant. Not saying these things are coming or likely to come, but its a decent thought experiment.

Surprised to see what they do with the Type S.

220hp, Awd, 6MT on the base would be fantastic. I would be very surprised if an AWD model comes with a manual. With them mentioning a LSD it feels unlikely that they meant a rear LSD. I also figure that LSD would be exclusive to 6MT models.

 

[Hondabob]

Retune for a BIT more power, offer AWD, skip the CVT and opt for DCT or 10-speed auto option along with the 6-speed manual. It would take the Integra from mid pack to (maybe still not class leading) but into that top 3 spot with it's balance of price/value, performance, AWD, features.

Couldnt agree more here. 220hp puts ahead of the spec sheet of the Germans (although that weak torque vs the comp doesn’t help). Giving AWD and an auto or manual option is another advantage vs the comp.

The CDX has 1.5t plus DCT in China so I’ve become more hopeful this is what we get.

 

[KoukiVAB]

In terms of the performance yes. The Integra is more inline with the Elantra N Line. However a full loaded Elantra N is 34,445 including destination. I'm sure there will be 1.5t Integras that are as expensive. I feel like more customers would shop and EN vs an Integra than the N Line

Don't forget that the EN is still a Hyundai, not Genesis. People who want more performance won't be looking at the base Integra at the price range. They have plenty of sport compacts to choose from.
Yes, people will be cross shopping them, but it will be more about pros/cons and personal preferences, not "which one's better performance bargain."
I mean, Golf R smokes almost everything in its price range but it won't stop people from buying entry level luxury cars.

 

[DipTheoryA]

I think it has to do with the mounting point and the fact that Acura never intended the 2.0T in the TLX to have a manual. The only one that essentially was getting a manual was the Integra and being that the Integra being in the works for 6 years it makes sense.

Right now what I’m hearing from someone is that it will get a 2.0T but they are not sure if it’s the 2.0T from the TLX/Accord or Type R but has also mentioned that it would come with 10 AT.

Hey, Tiger... you said the Integra has been in dev for 6 yrs. Was that a type-o?

 

[TigerEyeJazz]

Hey, Tiger... you said the Integra has been in dev for 6 yrs. Was that a type-o?

Jon Ikeda said that the inception of the Integra coming back was 6 years ago. Essentially they were approved to bring it back but due to the fact that the Civic 10th Gen was coming to a close they wanted to wait for the 11th Gen improved chassis for the Integra to come back. Essentially approved 6 years ago and has been working on it ever since.

I’m also trying to figure which publication had a discussion with him where he said that so I’ll update this when I find it.

 

[DipTheoryA]

What's your take on the performance levels being Si-like? Two things stood out to me recently (caution - wild speculation ahead!): Hondata and others seeing more available HP than Honda is claiming with the Si's 1.5t; and I watched a vid review of the Si where there was a pieced-in segment from an older guy that talked about the LSD seeming to still have some significant limits added (almost like the traction control wasn't completely defeated). I'll look later and see if I can find that link again - it's not one that I usually follow. Just thinking there might be some performance jump that we can expect from the existing Si powertrain+LSD that will be tuned to boost the Integra above the Si's capabilities. Afterall, they DID also decontent the Si vs. the Canadian market to some degree, (more wild speculation) to make room for the Integra's pricing & features? I'm thinking Acura may have more up its sleeve than the apparent reskinning of a feature-loaded Si and adding an AT. Thoughts?

 

[TigerEyeJazz]

What's your take on the performance levels being Si-like? Two things stood out to me recently (caution - wild speculation ahead!): Hondata and others seeing more available HP than Honda is claiming with the Si's 1.5t; and I watched a vid review of the Si where there was a pieced-in segment from an older guy that talked about the LSD seeming to still have some significant limits added (almost like the traction control wasn't completely defeated). I'll look later and see if I can find that link again - it's not one that I usually follow. Just thinking there might be some performance jump that we can expect from the existing Si powertrain+LSD that will be tuned to boost the Integra above the Si's capabilities. Afterall, they DID also decontent the Si vs. the Canadian market to some degree, (more wild speculation) to make room for the Integra's pricing & features? I'm thinking Acura may have more up its sleeve than the apparent reskinning of a feature-loaded Si and adding an AT. Thoughts?

For sure I feel that the reason why the Civic Si’s power numbers where higher then advertised was because of the Integra having the same engine. They could say that it makes 220 HP for the base engine so that it doesn’t seem to be a Civic Si copy cat. Features like fog lamps and heated seats, Steering wheel etc I would say 95% would be on the Integra. Only saying 95% because that’s what I feel and hasn’t been confirmed by Acura yet. AT is definitely coming as Acura mentioned that the Manual is “optional” which could imply that the AT and manual upgrade won’t have any cost increase. I’m hoping though the LSD actually comes on the AT as well and isn’t only reserved for the Manual. Also some luxury features should be added as in: HUD, full digital dash, ELS 3D Audio with roof mounted speakers etc. it’s going to be a nicely packaged car.

 

[bullitt]

I suspect either way the new Integra will have the same weak clutch as the Si. The Si really should be at like 220HP by now for it to be more relevant in its market. It's mostly riding on name right now than actual performance or bang/buck.

As the Integra is more for an "entry luxury with a sporty feel" the Si drivetrain will be fine.

 

[bullitt]

For sure I feel that the reason why the Civic Si’s power numbers where higher then advertised was because of the Integra having the same engine. They could say that it makes 220 HP for the base engine so that it doesn’t seem to be a Civic Si copy cat. Features like fog lamps and heated seats, Steering wheel etc I would say 95% would be on the Integra. Only saying 95% because that’s what I feel and hasn’t been confirmed by Acura yet. AT is definitely coming as Acura mentioned that the Manual is “optional” which could imply that the AT and manual upgrade won’t have any cost increase. I’m hoping though the LSD actually comes on the AT as well and isn’t only reserved for the Manual. Also some luxury features should be added as in: HUD, full digital dash, ELS 3D Audio with roof mounted speakers etc. it’s going to be a nicely packaged car.

Thats what base Integra and RSX has been for many generations. Why would Honda start to care now?

 

[TigerEyeJazz]

I suspect either way the new Integra will have the same weak clutch as the Si. The Si really should be at like 220HP by now for it to be more relevant in its market. It's mostly riding on name right now than actual performance or bang/buck.

As the Integra is more for an "entry luxury with a sporty feel" the Si drivetrain will be fine.

Agreed. The sporty feeling of Si will be on the Integra but probably will be elevated but a tad bit.

 

[TigerEyeJazz]

Thats what base Integra and RSX has been for many generations. Why would Honda start to care now?

I remember the RSX Type S power plant had 210 HP compared to the Civic Si at the time which only had 160 HP so it could give leverage to the RSX S.

Edit: first couple model years had 200. For some reason I looked up and 2005 had 201 or 210. Odd

 

[bullitt]

I remember the RSX Type S power plant had 210 HP compared to the Civic Si at the time which only had 160 HP so it could give leverage to the RSX S.

The base RSX was the same 160HP as the Civic Si. The Type-S had the Civic Type-R engine, and it was 201hp, not 210.