Bolt Ons: Intake / Intercooler / Header / Exhaust: Has Acura or Your Dealership Shop Heckled YOU or Denied Warranty on Your Integra Over Them?

[CyberCT]

The "Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act" is supposed to force car manufacturers to prove a modified part caused failure of another factory part directly associated with that modified part.

The question is ... how much of a stickler can Acura be over this, and how much must be proven?

Let's say there's an aftermarket intake and aftermarket intercooler on the Integra. A few years later, there's an engine issue of some sort (abnormal wear, bent valves, or some ACTUAL manufacturer defect) that's in Acura's direvetain warranty period.
If they simply say the aftermarket intake and intercooler lowered intake air temps below what the ECU expects, or added too much power for what the engine was designed for, or any other BS ... is that enough of a vague loophole for them to deny warranty coverage?
Or do they have to prove, through logged historical data downloaded from the car's ECU, exactly HOW these subtle changes in intake air temperature, velocity, or additional power ACTUALLY damaged the engine?
Who would force Acura to prove this?

I don't know how deep this rabbit hole goes ... but want to know if our drivetrain is safely covered through factory warranty while modding our cars with bolt ons.

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[slowcountry]

Is this a hypothetical or did ya throw a code?

 

[UWU-mancer]

Only saw this fuckery at a Saturn dealership. They weren’t ready for the type of folks that buy the ion redline and sky redline.

it was almost every single Saturn dealer too. Then something happened. I assume corporate got tired of taking calls and complaints from folks who own those two models. I assume corp told the dealers what was what.

 

[FurY]

You basically answered your question with the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, they would have to prove that the mods you installed contributed to any issues, thus voiding the warranty coverage. It will be a case by case basis, so you may or may not have to fight for coverage if they try to blame mods that are not associated to the service issue at hand.

Ultimately, I don't think you can make a blanket assessment of how it will be handled, as each dealership is different. If it's possible to revert to stock before taking the car in, that would probably help matters, but if you're concerned about it strongly enough, hold off the mod bug till your warranty is up, then you can do whatever you want without warranty coverage concerns.

 

[MERAKIAUTOWORKS]

Never had an issue.

-Josh

 

[NoelPR]

If this worries you, don't mod it. As simple as that.

The act sounds pretty on paper; in real life, it is another story, and only a few have had some luck fighting back.

 

[CyberCT]

You basically answered your question with the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, they would have to prove that the mods you installed contributed to any issues, thus voiding the warranty coverage. It will be a case by case basis, so you may or may not have to fight for coverage if they try to blame mods that are not associated to the service issue at hand.

Ultimately, I don't think you can make a blanket assessment of how it will be handled, as each dealership is different. If it's possible to revert to stock before taking the car in, that would probably help matters, but if you're concerned about it strongly enough, hold off the mod bug till your warranty is up, then you can do whatever you want without warranty coverage concerns.

I didn't answer my own question. The question is how in depth do they have to go to "prove" the mod caused the drivetrain issue. If the dealership says "the intake caused the engine to fail because the car wasn't designed for that intake" to me, that's not enough proof. But to a lawyer or judge, it might be. This is why I'm asking for people chime in that have had real world experiences of drivetrain issues AND mods, and how dealerships handled it.

 

[FurY]

I didn't answer my own question. The question is how in depth do they have to go to "prove" the mod caused the drivetrain issue. If the dealership says "the intake caused the engine to fail because the car wasn't designed for that intake" to me, that's not enough proof. But to a lawyer or judge, it might be. This is why I'm asking for people chime in that have had real world experiences of drivetrain issues AND mods, and how dealerships handled it.

I'm saying you answered your own question because you're aware of the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act and how it works. Every dealership and situation is going to be case by case basis, just because one person chimes in here to say that they had no problems, doesn't mean you won't either at the dealership you're using. Just like if someone DID have problems with warranty coverage with mods at a dealership, doesn't mean you will too because you may be working with a different dealership that doesn't have an issue with covering service under warranty with mods.

The real answer here is don't mod your car until after the warranty is over if you're concerned about not being covered, otherwise, you roll the dice and cross the bridge if you come to it. If modding is more important to you, just accept that you may be on the hook for any service needs that come up while the warranty period is still active if a dealership wants to play hardball with you for the mods you put on. No amount of feedback from people on here, positive or negative, changes this reality, you're basically hoping to get affirmation from people that it's ok to mod and still have a warranty, but you know the risks and you have to be the one to decide if it's worth it.

 

[CyberCT]

you're basically hoping to get affirmation from people that it's ok to mod and still have a warranty

That is correct. As far as I understand, dealerships have to submit claims to Honda before warranty work can begin. I ran into this with my 10th gen SI. At almost 100k miles, I had an issue with a half shaft. The dealership checked with Honda and Honda approved the warranty repair. I purchased their extended 8 year 120k mile bumper to bumper warranty when I bought the car, so I was covered 8 years later. I also had camber ball joints but nothing was mentioned about it.

So, maybe some dealerships will be reluctant to contact Honda seeing mods, while others might not be ... but it seems Honda has to do the final approval.

That's why I'm asking for people's experiences here.

If numerous people post about being denied engine or transmission fixes under warranty because they had an aftermarket intake or intercooler ... then we know these simple mods are a point of contention and the Magnuson–Moss Warranty Act is loosely followed.

If people were NOT denied engine or transmission fixes under warranty even if they had an aftermarket intake or intercooler, for example, then this is more of a non issue.

Perhaps a better question is to first ask which owners had problems with their engine, transmission, or turbo ... then see if mods were installed and were the fixes were covered under warranty (if still in the warranty period)

 

[UWU-mancer]

I didn't answer my own question. The question is how in depth do they have to go to "prove" the mod caused the drivetrain issue. If the dealership says "the intake caused the engine to fail because the car wasn't designed for that intake" to me, that's not enough proof. But to a lawyer or judge, it might be. This is why I'm asking for people chime in that have had real world experiences of drivetrain issues AND mods, and how dealerships handled it.

They don’t have to go in depth at all. “We aren’t going to cover x because we believe your modifications to x created that situation”

then you get a lawyer. And that’s when they’ll go in depth vs your expert going in depth. Typically this is mediated and not in a court room.

 

[CyberCT]

Perhaps an easy way determine their general enforcement would be to call different Honda and Acura dealerships and talk to the service managers, asking if they've experienced customer cars' drivetrain issues being denied warranty work by Honda or Acura .... and if so, what issues and were those mods just bolt ond or more significant.

I should have time next week to make the calls. The Integra 1.5l needs some help wringing more performance out of it, and bolt-ons should do it.

 

[slowcountry]

Got the extended warranty.. still modded

Honestly I'd take a look at the tuning threads between here and the civicxi forums - there are some known issues with modding/tuning but they're pretty limited and pretty easy to trace the cause and effect.

Anecdotal, but most warranty issues I've seen posted have not been related to or derivitive of modding/tuning. You could probably argue on a blown head gasket all day... but there are preventative mods for that as well.

 

[bvanlieu]

First, your interpretation of the MM act is incorrect. Its OK, most of the internet has it wrong.

The act is in place for if you use a OEM part for a *repair* or maintenance item, the manufacturer can't void your warranty. That STP paper air filter vs. the honda one is an example.

If you remove the airbox and install some other air intake, that is a different story.

Now, most dealers won't care about an intake, or an exhaust, but that is where the slope quickly gets slippery and if a dealer ignores it so be it, but do NOT expect that.

Think it through: you are the manager of the shop. A Honda blows a head gasket. Hondas are very reliable, this is rare. You go to file a several K warranty repair, it flags it in American Hondas system. They track severe failures of parts for many reasons, so this one isn't going to just fly through like say a leaking coolant res

Now AHC wants more info from dealer. Dealer may need to provide that, and lo and behold this car has an aftermarket downpipe. That's a bucket of nope, unless dealer refuses to disclose.

Say they don't disclose. AHC can send a tech out to review the car. You think they won't see the DP? Now the dealer is in a bind as well, not worth the risk at all.

There is no burden of proof on AHC: the actions of the owner replacing the part with a non-approved one is their basis for denial for a drive train issue.

Just own what you are doing: its your responsibility, not anyone else's.

 

[NoelPR]

Are you willing/capable to pay out of pocket if something goes wrong in a modded car?

If the answer is no, forget it. Keep it stock.

 

[optronix]

I understand the premise of OP's ask- it's a data gathering effort. But the data you're collecting from forum-goers and even whatever a service manager/advisor/tech is willing to disclose over the phone will almost assuredly be incomplete, likely biased, and nowhere near enough to extract meaningful analysis from.

The only meaningful output you're going to get from this effort is the admittedly pretty binary conclusion you've already probably arrived at; the only true form of avoiding the "warranty denial" issue is abstinence from modding entirely.

So the only logical conclusion to derive from your observation that your car needs more power: trade it for a Type S.

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